Democrat Charles Rangel Talks to MSNBC's Dylan Ratigan

Democrat Charles Rangel has told MSNBC’s Dylan Ratigan that throughout his years in Congress, he has never seen as much ‘hatred’ on the floor as he sees now, and that he believes religion hasn’t played as large of a role in Congress’ decision-making as it should.

Below is the transcript of the show;

DYLAN RATIGAN, HOST:  We turn our attention here to another conversation.  A week-and-a-half after being censured for ethics violations by his colleagues, Congressman Charlie Rangel is now looking forward to beginning his next term.  It will be his 21st.
 
He's also working to rehabilitate his reputation and, ultimately, his legacy.  He's doing so, of course, in a Congress that's seen its lowest approval ratings in years, just 17 percent say they like the job that our lawmakers are doing.  And, again, any of the sort of trust polling that you do, as we all know, comes -- continues to come in extraordinarily low.
 
Congressman Rangel joins us now for his first MSNBC interview since his censure.
 
And it's a pleasure to welcome you to the program.
 
REP. CHARLES RANGEL (D), NEW YORK:  Good to be here.
 
RATIGAN:  I want to -- I'm interested to talk to you about the overall optics and trust between the Congress, the government and the people and how you view your role and your responsibility, having been through what you've been through and have -- and we won't even get into it -- you've been -- it's been done.
 
But having been through what you've been through, how can you take that and use it as some form of currency to lead reform in this Congress in the process that will begin anything like something that would restore trust?
 
RANGEL:  I think it's pretty well accepted that -- if you were to go in my district and ask the people what do you think about the Congress, they'd say very little.  If you were to ask them what they think about Charlie Rangel, I got over 80 percent of the vote.
 
RATIGAN:  Which is typical for a lot of politicians.
 
RANGEL:  There is no question about that.  And a lot of my censure had to do with members knowing that people did not have confidence in the House of Representatives and they didn't want to get out there explaining me.
 
Quite frankly, while I was surprised and hurt that a censure came up, God knows I understood it, because once it got out there and people had to vote on the integrity of the Congress, it wouldn't have made any difference if it was an expulsion.  They will not want to go home and explain that.
 
And so I don't like to see people's careers be damaged by this frightenedness of the Congress and not being able to explain.  You can't do it in every case and it doesn't make a lot of political sense.
 
But as it relates to what you referred to as my legacy, the Ethics Committee gave it to me.  I asked for this investigation and they gave me more answers than I really wanted.
 
But the bottom line is that the chief counsel for the Ethics Committee says there is no corruption in this case.  Charlie Rangel has not been guilty in taking anything or violating any criminal laws.  He is guilty of sloppiness and over zealousness in trying to bring money to City College.
 
Is that wrong?
 
You bet your life it is.
 
Have I paid for it?
 
I would say I've paid dearly for it.  And it's not that I want this to happen to other members.  I really don't.  I -- I invite people to look at my Web site, at the allegations and the charges and then the sanction.
 
RATIGAN:  But isn't there a bigger issue here that has nothing to do with Charlie Rangel; that has nothing to do with the ethics of another given politician, whoever he or she may be, but has to do with a country that finds itself with a tremendous amount of spending inside of its government, a variety of systems in this country -- from education to trade to tax code to health care -- that clearly do not provide high output, high impact results for the American people, and the sense that the American Congress is not trustworthy to solve those problems.
 
And -- and it's easy to say, listen, well, Charlie Rangel, he's a crook.  See, now we took -- we took care of that because we've censured him.  But that doesn't solve the fundamental aspects of the government's relationship with money, the government's relationship with industry and the government's relationship with the people, fundamentally.
 
And don't you have an opportunity to -- to address that in this next session?
 
RANGEL:  I -- I -- I wish I did.  But quite frankly, if you take eight out of the allegations of 11 allegations, it all comes to one event.  And that event was asking people to consider to contribute to the City College of New York.  So it would be hard-pressed that had I asked for a wavier, there would have been just three allegations there.
 
And so my whole point is that I hope I would be there to encourage people to go to the private sector, to talk about the importance of education, and -- and I'm so frightened with the fact that we are not competitive a other countries.
 
And so my whole thing, over zealous, breaking the rules, paying the damages for it, has been education, education, education.
 
How can I take that and turn the Congress around with a reputation that I admit that...
 
RATIGAN:  Oh, I would agree.
 
RANGEL:  -- it -- it's low.
 
RATIGAN:  But what I would say is with the unique reputational equity that you now have, whether you want it or not, you are in a position to acknowledge to the American people, yes, have I done some things wrong?
 
You bet I have.
 
Are there things that are done wrong in this Congress everyday?
 
You bet there are.
 
Am I now going to take up the issue not of education, not of -- of a given policy, but the issue of distrust in the process of the legislative chamber -- an attempt to cultivate a -- a mechanism to restore that trust, through advocating transparency in those processes...
 
RANGEL:  Dylan, you have really...
 
RATIGAN:  -- that it's...
 
RANGEL:  -- raised a question that I will seriously consider.  I really thought tax reform and education and getting our kids out of Afghanistan -- I'm going to put that on the list.  My only hesitancy is that as it related to the Congress judging the conduct of its members, it has never been this partisan.  I have never seen the hatred that -- on the floor -- and -- and I have never seen friends that would come over and say, I wish I could help you, but I can't get my committee assignment if I get out there and say anything kind about you.
 
But I promise you, if we get back in two or three months, that I will discuss it with people that want to see that.  But if we start off not trusting each other, it's a real rough internal problem.
 
But what you're saying is right.  You cannot function unless people trust you.  You cannot even have a compromise on this important tax thing if you go to the table waiting for the others to make a mistake that you can capitalize on politically.
 
It's a big job.  And I can only tell you I'll step up to the plate. 
I think you want me to throw out the first ball but...
 
RATIGAN:  I do.
 
RANGEL:  I know.  But I -- I can only tell you that it hasn't been raised that -- you know, I'm still licking my wounds...
 
RATIGAN:  Of course.
 
RANGEL:  -- and -- but I -- I -- I really have to make certain that I get the hypocrisy out of this thing because it's on both sides of the aisle.  And while people in the past have fallen victim to it's a bad year for the Republicans, hey, it was a bad year, as everyone knows, for the Democrats.
 
But it's worth giving it a try.  And I would suggest, too, I don't think that religion has played as important a role on -- on the morality rate of the Congress as it should.  I really think when people don't get food stamps, don't get extensions of unemployment compensation, kids don't get an opportunity to finish school because they came here from a foreign country, that it doesn't -- it would not hurt the Congress to have a little more morality involved, rather than politics involved.
 
RATIGAN:  Yes.
 
RANGEL:  And I'm prepared to do more than my share.  God knows I've had a break in life...
 
RATIGAN:  Yes.
 
RANGEL:  And if I have to pay dues by aborting this with other people, especially younger members, I'll be there.
 
RATIGAN:  But I do think you've got a unique set of equity now to actually (INAUDIBLE)...
 
RANGEL:  I think you're right...
 
RATIGAN:  We have to say...
 
RANGEL:  -- especially with the younger members...
 
RATIGAN:  (INAUDIBLE).
 
RANGEL:  -- that really don't know what it used to be like.
 
RATIGAN:  Exactly.
 
RANGEL:  And -- and their obligations and what can happen if they make mistakes.
 
RATIGAN:  Yes.
 
Congressman, it's a real pleasure.
 
RANGEL:  Well, it has been for me, too.
 
RATIGAN:  All right.
 
All right, we'll talk to you soon.
 
Charlie Rangel.